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Forgery Alerts Reports and discussion regarding possible forgeries.

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Old Apr 5, 2007, 12:14 PM   #31
bpmurphy
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Art sent me a photo of the Baldwin Deka. Thanks Art.

Looking at the photo (called B), I disagree that it's the same reverse die as the Triton specimen (called C). Very close, butnot the same.

1) The left wing of B, there are four rows of dots whereas C only has 3.
2) The left wing of C is closer to the edge of the die than on B
3) The owls thighs on C are proportionally much shorther than on B.
4) B has no feathers directly between the eyes and on B the feathers touch the eye circles
5) the dots on the tail are different on the two coins

The letter positions seem to be identical and the number of feathers on each wing is the same. Maybe the dies were recut after use, but there are some significant differences.

Barry Murphy
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 12:29 PM   #32
Volodya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arthur Brand View Post
Is that a fact?
So tell me why parts of my book were translated by some IAPN-members into English? Meadows told me this. He had a copy.
If I am crazy, why are they reading each of my posts?
Art
Hi Art-- It's been a while, but I wouldn't want you to think I've forgotten you. I'm fascinated by the English translation of parts of your book. I'm quite sure that a fellow with a healthy ego like yours wouldn't have neglected to photocopy the translation. I certainly would have done that in your place. So, for those of us who don't read Dutch, I'm confident you'll be happy to scan and post a few pages of the translation. Who knows, maybe all of us language-challenged Americans will be so enamored of your wisdom we'll pay you for our own signed photocopies...

Oh, by the way, how come the Messana Hoard has dropped out of your litany of exposes? That was your first big coup; surely you want the numismatic world to fully understand how smart and well-informed you've always been? Could it be that you don't mention that hoard because it has turned out to be, uh, you know, genuine, beyond a smidgen of a shadow of a doubtlet? Just asking...

Phil Davis

Last edited by Volodya : Apr 5, 2007 at 04:36 PM.
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 12:36 PM   #33
Arthur Brand
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Originally Posted by Volodya View Post
Hi Art-- It's been a while, but I wouldn't want you to think I've forgotten you. I'm fascinated by the English translation of parts of your book. I'm quite sure that a fellow with a healthy ego like yours wouldn't have neglected to photocopy the translation. I certainly would have done that in your place. So, for those of us who don't read Dutch, I'm confident you'll be happy to scan and post a few pages of the translation. Who knows, maybe all of us language-challenged Americans will be so enamored of your wisdom we'll pay you for our own signed photocopies...

Oh, by the way, how come the Messagne Hoard has dropped out of your litany of exposes? That was your first big coup; surely you want the numismatic world to fully understand how smart and well-informed you've always been? Could it be that you don't mention that hoard because it has turned out to be, uh, you know, genuine, beyond a smidgen of a shadow of a doubtlet? Just asking...

Phil Davis
Are you the Phil Davis from HJB?
If so, I have a question for you: what happened with the Civil War Aurei that I exposed (thanks to Tkalec and others)? HJB sold them, didnīt he?
And what about that other fake Deka, sold by your boss, declared fake by the ISBCC?
Say hi to Harlan.

No further comments.

Art
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 12:48 PM   #34
Volodya
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Are you the Phil Davis from HJB?
If so, I have a question for you: what happened with the Civil War Aurei that I exposed (thanks to Tkalec and others)? HJB sold them, didnīt he?
And what about that other fake Deka, sold by your boss, declared fake by the ISBCC?
Say hi to Harlan.
No further comments.
Art
Oh, aren't you the adorable little disingenuous twerp? You know perfectly well who I am. Unlike you, I find it tedious to make the same points over and over again, but it seems I must.

1). I have no boss; never had one, never well.
2). My posts on the various lists are my own. With a tiny handful of technical exceptions, like responding to a post regarding Gemini Prices Realized, I've never discussed anything regarding HJB in an online group like this, nor will I.

On the other hand, my questions to you were simple and straightforward, directly related to points you have made yourself. "No further comments." Oh please, do you hope to be someone's press secretary when you grow up?

Phil
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 12:50 PM   #35
Arthur Brand
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1). I have no boss; never had one, never well.
So this isnīt you?

http://www.harlanjberk.com/departments/experts.asp
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 12:50 PM   #36
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Here are the photos and catalog description.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg bald rev.jpg (117.8 KB, 94 views)
File Type: jpg bald obv.jpg (113.0 KB, 87 views)
File Type: jpg bald desc.jpg (49.9 KB, 87 views)
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:00 PM   #37
Volodya
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Yes of course that's me. When have I ever said differently? Apparently, "The best defense is a good offense" is a dumb truism in Dutch as well as English.

Phil
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:06 PM   #38
Arthur Brand
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Let me explain for those who donīt know what happened with the other Fake Deka.

1. The coin was bought by CNG
2. The ISBCC and other experts declared the coin fake
3. CNG asked Kovacs to reclean the coin and they demanded that the ISBCC withdrew the condemnation
4. CNG sells the coin
5. The person who bought it, immediately offers it to HJB/Freeman for their Gemini-auction.
6. Gemini accepts the coin and offers it a few hours after the Triton auction from CNG where an authentic Deka is sold. They hope that the underbidders for the Triton coin will bid on the Gemini.
7. Because of all the rumors by MvR and me, nobody bids, except for... Kovacs who cleaned the coin for CNG a second time (see point 3)

Itīs this kind of lack of ethics why I am so angry.

Art
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:16 PM   #39
Volodya
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Originally Posted by Arthur Brand View Post
Let me explain for those who donīt know what happened with the other Fake Deka.
1. The coin was bought by CNG
2. The ISBCC and other experts declared the coin fake
3. CNG asked Kovacs to reclean the coin and they demanded that the ISBCC withdrew the condemnation
4. CNG sells the coin
5. The person who bought it, immediately offers it to HJB/Freeman for their Gemini-auction.
6. Gemini accepts the coin and offers it a few hours after the Triton auction from CNG where an authentic Deka is sold. They hope that the underbidders for the Triton coin will bid on the Gemini.
7. Because of all the rumors by MvR and me, nobody bids, except for... Kovacs who cleaned the coin for CNG a second time (see point 3)
Itīs this kind of lack of ethics why I am so angry.
Art
And blah blah blah... There must be an echo in here; I could swear I've heard these points before. Gee Art, for someone who is oh so outraged when someone ducks your questions, you seem awfully eager to change the subject and duck mine. I try to assume the best of people, I really do, but is it possible there really is no English translation of parts of your book? And, since apparently nothing registers with you unless it's endlessly repeated, Messana Hoard, Messana Hoard, Messana Hoard...

Phil

Last edited by Volodya : Apr 5, 2007 at 04:36 PM.
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:16 PM   #40
4to2centophilia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arthur Brand View Post
Let me explain for those who donīt know what happened with the other Fake Deka.

1. The coin was bought by CNG
2. The ISBCC and other experts declared the coin fake
3. CNG asked Kovacs to reclean the coin and they demanded that the ISBCC withdrew the condemnation
4. CNG sells the coin
5. The person who bought it, immediately offers it to HJB/Freeman for their Gemini-auction.
6. Gemini accepts the coin and offers it a few hours after the Triton auction from CNG where an authentic Deka is sold. They hope that the underbidders for the Triton coin will bid on the Gemini.
7. Because of all the rumors by MvR and me, nobody bids, except for... Kovacs who cleaned the coin for CNG a second time (see point 3)

Itīs this kind of lack of ethics why I am so angry.

Art
Well, regarding point 7.....two people bid. Whether one of them bid as part of an agreement to move the price to an acceptable level, I don't know. But two people bid on the coin.

OK, I'll let you kids roll in the mud some more.
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:18 PM   #41
Arthur Brand
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I am not trying to glorify myself Phil, I am just trying to defend myself against people who say that my comments are worthless.

May I remind you that the stolen Dekadrachm from Nino Savoca, a picture that nobody had ever seen, was published by me? It seems that I have good contacts after all.

http://www.michelvanrijn.nl/artnews/ninohappyhour.htm


And who published all the Dekadrachms from the Elmali-hoard for the first time?

http://www.michelvanrijn.nl/artnews/DEKAAAAS.htm

Again, I have to say these things to prove that I am not some kind of idiot who knows nothing.

Art
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:22 PM   #42
Arthur Brand
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Originally Posted by Volodya View Post
but is it possible there really is no English translation of parts of your book?
Ask Andrew. Ute Wartenberg ordered my book through a middleman.

----- Original Message -----
From: Ute Wartenberg
To: Arthur Brand
Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 12:20 AM
Subject: Re: Carchemish-hoard


Dear Arthur,

thank you for your email. I have not had a chance to read your book, although I got a copy through the ANS.

Best wishes,
Ute
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:25 PM   #43
4to2centophilia
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Detailed description from catalog
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File Type: jpg bald3.jpg (147.0 KB, 98 views)
File Type: jpg bald4.jpg (255.2 KB, 97 views)
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:28 PM   #44
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Just for clarity sake. Frank Kovacs was not bidding on the coin for himself. Frank Kovacs often represents buyers at auctions and was acting in this regard in the bidding on the coin in question. I am not sure how his representing a buyer for a coin adds weight to your arguement. I would say that in the previous days auction the Deka went for such a high amount that I am not surprized that only two people had the stomach and deep wallets for the Gemini's sample.
Ronn
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Old Apr 5, 2007, 01:33 PM   #45
Volodya
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Originally Posted by Arthur Brand View Post
I am not trying to glorify myself Phil, I am just trying to defend myself against people who say that my comments are worthless.
May I remind you that the stolen Dekadrachm from Nino Savoca, a picture that nobody had ever seen, was published by me? It seems that I have good contacts after all.
http://www.michelvanrijn.nl/artnews/ninohappyhour.htm
And who published all the Dekadrachms from the Elmali-hoard for the first time?
http://www.michelvanrijn.nl/artnews/DEKAAAAS.htm
Again, I have to say these things to prove that I am not some kind of idiot who knows nothing.
Art
Art, you have my profound sympathy. It must be awful being you, trapped in your personal "Ground Hog's Day", forced to repeat the same talking points ad nauseum. I'll go back to watching paint dry; more happens.

Phil
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