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Forgery Alerts Reports and discussion regarding possible forgeries.

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Old Mar 2, 2010, 04:19 PM   #1
BeastCoins
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Fake Constantine Hat at auction

Thanks to John Mixter for sending me an email to this fake currently at auction:



Pegasi Numismatics, Auction XXII, Lot 599:

CONSTANTINE I, 307-337 AD. Æ Follis-Medallion (3.06 gm), Thessaloniki (TS*A). DN CONSTAN [ ] VS P F P T AV[ ] Draped bust wearing a tall hat / VICTORIAE LAETAE PRINCI [ ] Two Victories confronted, holding votive shield over altar. RIC.-. VF, brown patina, porosity. Extremely Rare. [Est. $350]

And here is my, as of yet unique as far as I know, example that the above fake is copying.



Constantine I, AE3, 318-319 (for exergue mark), Siscia, Officina 3
IMP CON_STANT_INVS PERT AVG
Draped, cuirassed bust of Constantine I right, wearing Pannonian cap
VICTORIAE LAETAE PRINC PERP
Two Victories, standing facing each other, inscribing shield with VOT | PR on altar with X and + design (altar type Y)
gSIS in exergue
18mm x 19mm, 3.27g
RIC VII, --

I was made aware several years ago of this fake via some good folks over at Forvm, so I recognized it immediately when John sent me the auction link.

I'm sure the submitter chose Pegasi for the consignment as I have never spoken to Nick or Eldert about my coin, so they would not know this is a fake. I'm sending them an email so they can withdraw it from the auction. Just a note - the exergual mark on the fake is gSIS as on my coin and since my example has some ambiguitiy in the obverse legend, the forger went with what looks like PEPT whereas mine is still unclear as to PART, PERT or something else.

Sigh.

--Beast
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Old Mar 3, 2010, 06:30 AM   #2
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It should, of course, be PERP.

Richard
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Old Mar 3, 2010, 06:56 AM   #3
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Richard,

I am unaware of any obverse legend with PERP contemporary to my coin. Are there any from c.319 or during the Constantine era? I do know of later pieces with PERP in the obverse legend.



I was thinking a while back it might be FORT, based on what I was researching in 2004:



The obverse legend reads D N DECENTI_VS FORT CAES. Here is a comparison:



And here is the section on my website where I began working on the hypotheses of the coin being genuine or fake.

http://www.beastcoins.com/Topical/VL...Challenges.htm


Thanks!

--Zach
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Old Mar 3, 2010, 08:44 AM   #4
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lol--I think it was a joke. PERP as in perpetrator. Am I wrong Richard?
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Old Mar 3, 2010, 08:51 AM   #5
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Voz,

But the reverse legend ends in PERP(ETVI). Perhaps the obverse legend is PERP(OSTVROVS)?

--Beast
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Old Mar 3, 2010, 11:31 AM   #6
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What exactly makes this coin fake? It looks a lot more convincing than yours.
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Old Mar 3, 2010, 11:39 AM   #7
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areich,

Please give your input as to why you believe the Pegasi specimen may be real and is more convincing than my example, and I will give my reasons for believing it to be a modern fake.

Thanks,

--Beast
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Last edited by BeastCoins : Mar 3, 2010 at 02:02 PM. Reason: Reworded my request for more information.
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Old Mar 4, 2010, 07:50 AM   #8
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Always this same serie of late Roman AEs fakes ..
http://www.ancients.info/forums/showthread.php?t=2801
See 1st picture.

Jérôme
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Old Mar 4, 2010, 10:32 AM   #9
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I'm not saying it's real but I wonder why you just assume theirs is fake and yours isn't. It looks more convincingly ancient than your coin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roma_Orbis View Post
Always this same serie of late Roman AEs fakes ..
http://www.ancients.info/forums/showthread.php?t=2801
See 1st picture.

Jérôme
I see, that is a convincing argument, that the second coin is fake.
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Old Mar 4, 2010, 11:05 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by areich View Post
I see, that is a convincing argument, that the second coin is fake.
This was not supposed to be an argument to convince anybody (nor was it a reply to your post), just a reference to a serie well-known from years. Ask so B. Murphy ... he showed pictures some years ago.

But then talking about arguments, a die-match to a known pressed fake is intrinsically a fake, yes, no wonder. Oh well ...

Jérôme

Last edited by Roma_Orbis : Mar 4, 2010 at 11:15 AM.
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Old Mar 4, 2010, 01:16 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by areich View Post
I'm not saying it's real but I wonder why you just assume theirs is fake and yours isn't. It looks more convincingly ancient than your coin.
Areich,

If you would, please explain why you think the Pegasi specimen looks more convincingly ancient than mine and I will explain why I think the Pegasi piece is false. I need to understand what you are thinking before I can offer a rebuttal or I will just be guessing.

So, please go first - why do you think the coin is ancient?

Thank you in advance,

--Zach
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Old Mar 4, 2010, 09:05 PM   #12
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Funny thing is that I was thinking the same thing.

Of course I know a bit of the history of "the hat coin" having casually followed some of the past discussions on the object in question. If I remember correctly, some knowledgable folks have examined it closely and believe it to be authentic. I remain somewhat skeptical--purely based on the coin's aesthetics.

The hat on Zach's coin, though seemingly proportional to the head, encroaches upon the legend to a degree that makes the coin look very odd compared to anything else I can recall. Whereas the other coin has a head (and hat) which fit comfortably on the coin and leave appropriate space for the legend.

If I didn't know the second coin was a fake, I would have considered it the strongest evidence in support of the first coin's authenticity.

Voz Earl
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Old Mar 15, 2010, 12:06 PM   #13
areich
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Zack, I don't pretend to be an expert on these. I'm sceptical of your coin and just from the look and surfaces the other one appeared possibly ancient, or 'more convincingly ancient' to me. Thena again they can make pretty convincing fakes if they really try.
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Old Mar 16, 2010, 05:31 AM   #14
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I still like it!

I was intriqued by Zach's coin for years...thinking it may well be a trail strike.
The area of issue bodes well for this design.
The only drawbacks to this already have been noted..including the high relief of the hat.
The imagary of the Emperor wearing such a device is plausible, though I would be more inclined if it were decorated with imperial symbols.
Again, if it were a trail strike that could be overlooked.
This current photo, though, brings to question if the modern die maker is experimenting with his work.
Regardless, an interesting concept and my "hats off" to the creator..well done...and if indeed it is modern, please make one for my collection!
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Old Sep 2, 2010, 09:27 AM   #15
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Smile

I doubt anyone has noticed this but here's a photo from the latest auction from Rauch (Sommerauktion 2010, 13 September) lot 1717. I wonder which one is 'eine moderne Phantasiemünze'?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Lot 1717.jpg (36.4 KB, 93 views)
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